That’s not exactly what he said. He said that he’s not balancing the dungeons for us to win them, with win probably meaning “do everything totally safely, take no losses”. They’re supposed to be hard.
Okay, but expecting someone to die is not the same as designing someone to die. Like him being surprised that twitch plays DnD hasn’t resulted in character deaths doesn’t mean he’s designing the encounters to kill us.
But he does design some encounters that he doesn’t have an inkling of how we will solve, like the King Rat in the vault. Usually those are optional. Or we can be surprised by a twist while out of resources.
Mind you, I am OK with it. I just leave the reminder because people shouldn’t assume we don’t need the new characters because the game is supposedly set up so we can always get out of trouble – it isn’t. It is supposed to be hardcore, there is supposed to be experimentation, and loss resulting from such experimentation. This was all said. We can eff up, or have an encounter we may not be able to beat just with the normal characters because of any reason, and the new characters should be used longterm to make us safer.
Word of God is that characters can die in the Dungeons. If it comes to pass that this new ‘fungal overlord’ falls and cannot get up.. how useful would mushroom soup be?
Not nearly as busted as implied, though Little Mushroom will be a large part of that. I’m expecting some sort of Interpose-esque ability to redirect attacks, as being locked to 2 Def before rings and accessories is rough. Probably some healing too to offset using HP as a resource. Reminder that spending HP doesn’t create Remorse. Not even much inventory, though to be fair none of that will be spent on equipment for personal use.
Everyone other than Botanya is Bond capped, so not much loss to bringing the mushroom. Mushrooms aren’t plants, so I don’t expect Bloom to give additional HP.
Hmm, Infestation only needs organic creatures, but the undead we’ve lensed have been immune to poison damage so I don’t know if killing with poison damage would trigger. Might, if there was poison damage as part of the lethal attack including other damage. Wonder if Cordy tag teaming with Lara could trigger Infestation off Venomous Sting plus mushroom punch.
An overpowered character would be Kamau from before the fall. 15 HP, 3 Atk/Def, 3 ring slots, 12 inventory, built in Proficiency for a unique custom greatsword.
As ick as it is, I think we’re likely looking at Cordy being able to increase our Labor pool by 5-6 pets on the first dungeon he participates in, and then start taking tiers of Mushroom Master to start adding 6-7-8-9… labor each further dungeon he joins.
So he is, as thisnameismeta theorized, going to dramatically increase our gold-per-dungeon if we use him regularly.
-For tackling the mob of chickens, Kamau’s Interpose works but if we brought three melee characters “They would split their attacks evenly, just animals” -LSN 2023
-Scarecrow prevents Magicrows from attacking. Theoretically this works on normal crows too, but just Magicrows in the dungeon. They cannot attack even if attacked, though once they’re hostile they will attack once you reach a room without a scarecrow.
-Crows moved on when no more produce in the room, mostly interested in the corn knight
-Scarecrow could be destroyed with damage or any amount of fire. Crows would then obliterate corn knight, but steal corn.
-Crows would wipe the dungeon for us if we let them
-Tromatochet introduced on its own to show off stats and instant alert
-Treehouse had the gardening gloves, showing how utility items like rope with no indicated purpose can be used. Also greater healing potion
-Setting tree on fire would deal with enemies, but then the chest is in a fire. The magma shield and fire robes together would probably make it safe if you could get up there.
-Elder magicrow hint: one eye 10 crows, second eye produce, third eye time limit. You have until turn 40 to give us 10 produce. Otherwise they attack the flower and would likely kill Botanya, no longer accepting bribes.
-Turn 15 the flower breaks ground and the scarecrow, growing one floor every 5 turns. Turn 35 reached the sky, then all the crows flock to the flower.
-Crows could fly above the barn through the gap in dungeon rooms
-Letting crows steal produce while helping them counts as bribing them, Magicrows are smarter than usual animals. If they got the 10 produce on their own they’d still leave but wouldn’t give the crow call.
-Other magic birds? Magepies? Created by QuadroCubes.
-Gravity staff on the sky works to keep crows away from there, but then they’re hostile for keeping them from food
-Pumpking would have been killed by hay drop. It is tough and has the Impassable ability, you can’t run by it. Lara web works to climb over. It drops a pumpkin.
-Chicken coop started with a rooster, every 5 turns it spits out a chicken and 20% chance of another rooster or 100% if there’s no rooster. If another rooster shows up, it takes half the chickens and starts wandering the dungeon.
-Farming for eggs lets you get the produce to win, but they only stack to 3 to discourage this.
-5 corn in the coop gives a pet egg, as we found.
-Potato beasts are afraid of light and that drops Def to 0. They’re a grue.
-A dungeon with spawners can be cleared if there are no current monsters in the dungeon. Any theoretical chickens in the indestructible, inaccessible coop don’t count.
-Rats chest had unique Frying Pan, 2 fire damage weapon which can cook food. Raw meat, or convert produce to healing items. Corn to popcorn, 50% chance to heal 1 because it’s so plentiful. Fried egg, tomato sauce… Didn’t fully stat out all options because we didn’t get the pan.
-Keys in barn would open locked doors.
-Stalkroach went downstairs away from light, past enemies, then eaten by a grue/potato. With other chests opened first it couldn’t hide well.
-2 unblockable fall damage from roof to ledge, or just die to ground. One floor down is safe, 2+ floors deal damage. Gravity reduction from staff halves falling damage and half of 1 is 0.
-Weather vane: Change which direction the crows and chickens move. Pumpking would let monsters out. They have to move with the wind unless they’re at the end. With wind to the left crows would bounce between the first two rooms with scarecrows and we could kill them without them able to fight back.
-Bats: 3 regular, 1 mystery type.
-Chickens can climb ladders, couldn’t just pick off the big barn crowd from range.
-Mammoth tusks are treasure, weight 1 cost 10. Mammoth hide is hide armour +5Def vs cold. Hay bale would deal 5 unblockable damage if dropped.
-Manny can’t fit into the barn, and 3 turns of trying would knock down the barn which would destroy all but the vane, the coop, and the now open puzzle chest. Probably 5 unblockable damage per floor above you, so in short anyone inside would die, with the “explicit” hint that anyone in the barn would feel the whole barn shaking from being hit by a mammoth.
-Puzzle chest contains Breaker, 1 handed hammer +3. Can smash unopened non-puzzle chests which also destroys any item inside, gets +1 Atk per chest destroyed up to 3, reset at end of dungeon. Sacrifice loot for a +6 one-handed weapon?
-Reward for not killing Manny is to feel good about yourself.
-Macadamia could totally Dig into the underground room before turn 15, but not much reason to try.
-Locked chest underground had Mystic Vase. 5x dungeon heal 2 HP to a plant, tool/treasure cost 20. Also Monk Robes (from belt because no belt slot, too hard to see) and pipes which now have special effect with a music ability.
-Chests have items from mother’s friends. This is from another game which should release later this year.
-Jumping off the flower would be 5 unblockable damage from falling
-Botanya cannot attack with wands, though she could use a wand of fireball to burn a rope. Her flytrap pet is mobile even though the enemy is immobile.
-All pets are small or smallish so they can always follow.
-There are no negative numbers in Dungeon Eyes. Penalties can’t give you a stat below 0, though all bonuses are given a chance to cancel out.
-Enemy drops cannot be taken with Steal or found with Case, even the gold pieces thugs have. The drop chance isn’t even rolled until the enemy group is finished off.
-Bows are different for crossbow proficiency. A slingshot might count as a crossbow.
-Case works on puzzle chests. Case gives item stats, including for chest contents.
-Sneaky is an action. If you want to do anything else, it’ll need to be on the next turn after sneaking through. If this puts you behind enemies, they probably won’t turn to see you.
-Trap Disarming: can disarm onions. Might or might not identify the trap you disarmed, especially if the trigger is separate from the trap like in the Warrens where the pressure plate activated the arrow chest.
-Rat kings spawn on turn 40 and every 10 turns, first at back and second at front. Even worse things might come up at 60 (every room grows a corn knight?), but that wasn’t necessary.
-Gardening gloves shield from onions and let you pick all plants of one type at once. Won’t come up again
-Being on the flower while it’s growing isn’t dangerous.
-Dungeon creatures can be followers vs pets. Botanya counted as a follower, not really helping. Manny wouldn’t really follow.
-How does Pumpking fight? Dirty.
-A full stack of produce might distract a rat king for a turn.
-Building housing for all the other NPCs isn’t something we do for a reward, that is the goal. Labour isn’t how to get gold, dungeons are for gold.
-Renovations don’t give benefits until the dungeon after you buy them since they need to be built. If we buy a room this time, it’ll be after dungeon 8 that the room finishes and we get the HP boost and Bond cap break.
-Recruiting a pet during the dungeon when at max pet capacity would send the pet to the Manor.
-Only pet master pet eggs are random. Not a coincidence that the chicken pet egg hatched into a chick.
-If this goes past 3 years, grouchy… 5 years tops. Don’t need another 10-year comic. My observation: Combine that with how we’ve done 7 dungeons in just over a year, and consider how long term you really want to plan for character growth.
-Inspecting a dungeon element is an action (!) you are expected to take sometimes.
-Drew turn 50 page on Sunday with departure vote, then vote shifted by Monday so that was scrapped.
-The last turn with multi panel montage does include actions, and then narrative exit.
-Kamau, Lara, and Macadamia formally joined the party in the dungeon as the party couldn’t be full yet. Macadamia followed for a while first. Other characters might follow, might join in intermission, might join mid dungeon if someone dies.
Highlights:
Renovations have build time. We need to get those rooms online soon if we want to get more bond points. I now suspect that there won’t be a friendship dungeon for clearing the first block, I think that the friendship dungeon is unlocked at the second block and completing that dungeon with the character is what maxes bond since every bond track has only one point in the third section. If this is right, we could max Lara pretty quickly and get that max bond bonus for Ricki.
More expectation about total game length: The projection is 3 years of dungeon eyes to finish, and we’ve passed one year. Don’t take renovations in hopes of paying themselves back in 10 dungeons because the game will be almost over by then. For level up choices, if your argument is “this will eventually get better”, you should also explain how many of the expected 14 remaining dungeons will benefit, and which ones will see that character. We might get a few more, there are 7 friendship dungeons if each of the 7 non bonus characters get one, but the game will end. Eventually you have to stop saving for the future and cash in.
Yeah, so wildly projecting off of those comments, as LSN did kinda revise upward after initially saying 3 years total, we’re looking at 21-35 total dungeons (3-5×7… unless they start getting shorter/we get better about exiting quickly, or… just about anything at all changes, really), and 14-28 remaining of that number.
He also made a bunch of comments around character progression indicating that we can’t plan on getting everything (obviously) and that we’ll need to pick and choose.
Which I think is going to strongly encourage us to really focus on growing a core party and leaving everybody else as level 1-2 scrubs. CLASSIC RPG (Looking right at you, Torneko Taloon).
>Don’t take renovations in hopes of paying themselves back in 10 dungeons because the game will be almost over by then.
I think it’s less that they necessarily need to pay themselves off within a certain timeframe, and more that if we’re going to build them AT ALL we need to build them as quickly as possible.
There’s not much point in building the Kobold Den or the Sentry Outpost at dungeon 20 because the game will be over or close to over by then. But if we build them now, we’ll both a) make our money back, and b) supplement our hauls from future dungeons so we can afford other upgrades.
I outlined a plan in a different comment that would let us get the Kobold Den and the Sentry Outpost by selling stuff we don’t need/aren’t using, which would mean +7 Gold for each Dungeon we complete once built for the price of 70 Gold. For roughly that same price, we could either increase someone’s bond threshold and maybe pick up one of the renovations that gives additional storage/upgrade paths (80 Gold), or we could pick up two of those renovations that give additional storage/upgrade paths (60 Gold). Between those three options I feel like buying Labor is honestly the best use of our money.
There’s also the possibility that Labor will be useful for other things aside from just a flat 1 Labor = 1 Gold at some point, or that Labor will become more efficient with certain upgrades. Even something like 3 Labor:4 Gold would be good, let alone a 2:3 or 1:2 ratio for Labor:Gold.
We’re locked on bond for everybody but Botanya at this point. We’ve been told maxing bond out will be very very good, so we need to prioritize it. I expect that it’ll be much more impactful than additional labor.
I’m sure that maxing bond out will be good, sure. The thing is- even if we build Kamau or Lara’s upgrade now, we still have to both a) increase their bond to the NEXT threshold, and b) do whatever we need to do to get past the second threshold after that in order to fully max out their Bond. Until we do that, the only thing we’re getting from those upgrades is the ability to get Bond for those characters and an additional +1 HP for characters that haven’t really needed it thus far.
Basically, I think that going for Lara or Kamau’s upgrade right now is a risky use of our current funds because it doesn’t give us much for the amount of gold we’re spending, whereas spending our gold on Labor now is a pretty safe bet because it can only offer us more gold over time. Buying Labor now also means that we’ll be able to more easily afford character upgrades in the future.
EDIT: That being said, if we DO decide to build a character upgrade I think we should do Lara’s first. Doing that will give us a better idea of what that means more quickly since she only needs one Bond point to reach her next threshold. But if we have to build a second upgrade to get past that second threshold- which is what I’m worried about- we’re really going to want to build up as much Labor as we possibly can to have as much income as we possibly can. Hence, why I’m advocating for the Kobolds and Sentries.
Plus- think of the children, man! Those poor Kobolds got kicked out of their home; the least we could do is build them a place to sleep so they can have somewhere comfortable to sleep while building the rest of the manor and harvesting our crops!
The thing we need to do to get to the next threshold is probably the bond dungeon. Since dungeons are our major source of income, getting set up to do bond dungeons sooner rather than later also boosts income, and gives us effectively more time and total income.
You’re probably right about the next threshold being the bond dungeon.
That being said: I still think building up the passive gold that we’re getting at the manor as quickly as possible is more important. If we have 7 Labor and three characters/pets stay behind, that gives us 10 Gold per dungeon.
That’s 10 Gold towards any other upgrade, per dungeon, before we even account for the loot we find.
That 10 Gold gets us 1/3 of the way towards advancing one of the different upgrade paths (like the kitchen); or it means we only need to bring in 40 Gold worth of stuff to get a character specific upgrade. Not to mention the possibility of using it to buy basic supplies, ammunition, etc.
The ability to get bond points is important, yes, and I definitely think we should think about building Lara and Kamau’s upgrades within the next few dungeons. But building up this infrastructure now is going to give us a ton of benefit over time. It’s basically RTS logic; you gotta have your farmers, miners, lumberjacks, etc. producing resources (Gold) before you worry about building up your big advanced units (adventurers).
Counterpoint. If a dungeon gives us 40 or so gold loot on average, we will unlock Lara’s bond dungeon in two dungeons if we build her room now and take her to the dungeon after it is done. That would yield 40 gold after 3 dungeons, compared to at best 8 gold in the same time period for the 4 labor from the kobold warrens.
I don’t think we can really rely on getting consistent gold per dungeon, though? This last adventure was a bit of an outlier because we were basically farming (ba-dum-tish) gold. Expecting to get fifty gold per dungeon, or even fourty, would basically assume that we don’t like any of the loot we got. That or we got good enough loot that we can feel good about selling older big ticket items without feeling bad.
Again- buying Labor is the safest bet because we know that we’re paying for something that will appreciate in value over time, which means that buying it quickly is smarter than waiting. Every point of Labor is a guaranteed 1 Gold, and Gold is the only resource that matters when it comes to upgrading the manor, which subsequently unlocks character upgrades and other upgrade paths that we don’t even know about yet.
It would take 11 dungeons between when we spend the gold to get the kobold housing and when the labor from the kobold warrens have paid for themselves (because it takes a dungeon for the building to complete, and only adds 4 labor). I’m absolutely in favor of building the NPC housing, but not at the expense of wasting multiple dungeons worth of bond when all of our characters are maxed. I want to see as much story as possible, and given the timeline we are on, I don’t think we can afford to put off building character bedrooms as long as you seem to want us to. If you don’t think we will net enough gold to build character bedrooms in average dungeons, then it’s even more important that we not spend our windfall on upgrades that will take 10 dungeons to even return the money spent on them, let alone start funding further upgrades.
The thing is- if we don’t buy them at a certain point, they’re actually going to be a net negative on our finances because we won’t “pay them off” in time. If we hold off on them now, then that’s seven less Gold in our pocket for each Dungeon we wait for building them. In two dungeons, that’ll be 14 Gold; in three, it’ll be 21, and so on.
I’ve also detailed a revised plan down below that would let us afford the 120 Gold required to buy the Kobolds, the Sentries, AND either the Tower for Lara or the Apartment for Kamau by selling a lot of our clutter. I think picking the Tower would be a pretty good idea, since it would potentially let us do Lara’s Bond Dungeon after we finish up with the Village Well/Zombie Tomb.
The thing about that is that they’re never a net negative on our finances if we don’t build them. We probably won’t and can’t build every room in the Manor. Sure, then we never get the income, but every dungeon that gets us closer to maxing Bond means more dungeons to take advantage of whatever abilities Ricki gets from maxing out Bond. To put it this way, say that we were told we’d get an extra level up two dungeons from now – would it be worth spending 4 gold now to get that extra level up at the end of next dungeon so we get an extra dungeon’s worth of that ability?
I also suspect that the bond dungeons may not even be available until after the next big story event, just like how it wasn’t possible to break the first cap until we unlocked the Manor and the ability to build rooms. Lara’s Tower is the only way to know for sure. Either way, we need to pick someone that we’ll want to use in the dungeon after the next one.
That’s true; at the same time, I feel like building up Labor early is going to pay off at some point. It’s very odd that it would take 11 Dungeons to pay off the cost of buying Labor, as other people have pointed out. It really makes me think that at some point we’ll be able to upgrade our Labor; either by making it generate more income, or by allowing us to use our Labor to generate other resources at a discount (for example, Healing Potions and other consumables).
In any case, I don’t want to belabor my point too much. We have a ton of potential cash on hand at the moment, but we do still have to be a bit careful about how spend it if we want to buy other items aside from Manor upgrades.
Honestly, it might be best to buy a little bit of everything; grab Labor, a room for Kamau and/or Lara, and check out one of the potential upgrade paths like the Kitchen or Library. That would give us a little margin for gearing up for the zombies, I think.
LSN said directly on stream that housing NPCs is a goal, not a means to an end. Labour is a nice bonus to have as a reward for people not dying, and I don’t think that Labour being suspiciously bad for cost is an indication that it will get better.
Agreed that Library is promising, as that seems most likely to unlock access to more enchantment scrolls. Getting more out of existing equipment is the next way to become stronger now that we mostly filled out our slots with good stuff.
Oh, I like the game a lot. It’s just dealing with these minmaxing munchkins that grab the steering wheel and won’t let go. Everything is all about increasing stats or stat-related. “How can we get the biggest possible haul from this dungeon” because obviously that’s why this game was created in the first place.
We also got confirmation that heavy strike does work with cleave to buff the subsequent attack that cleave triggered. The -3 from cleave is off of the previous attack, not what a new attack would theoretically be absent heavy strike etc.
Sorry about the magepies everyone! But also not sorry at all.
Spider Minstrel
1 year ago
Yay!
Go Cordy! Go Cordy! The SHROOM with the BOOM!
I say we take Cordy into the dungeon. Let’s check out what those lil’ mushroom pets can do!
Alterkat
1 year ago
So, what sorts of upgrades are we thinking about in regards to the manor? As much as I’d like to start working on bond stuff, it seems like buying additional Labor might give us the best return on our gold in the long term.
We have seven characters now, which means we should have a base level of 3 Labor for this next dungeon even if we don’t buy anything. (I believe the 1 Labor we have now is from Lara.) Each point of Labor = +1 Gold per dungeon that we don’t have to worry about carrying home. If we don’t take all of our pets (taking the pet chick seems like a really bad idea for example) then we also get additional Labor for each one we don’t take.
If we buy the Kobold Den and Sentry Post that gives us a baseline of 7 Labor, not accounting for any characters or pets that might die who will also contribute to that amount if they’re left at home. +7 Gold per dungeon isn’t overwhelmingly amazing, but it’ll definitely add-up the quicker we’re able to get those things built. And when you account for the fact that Labor is supposed to be a secondary source of Gold income compared to dungeon loot I feel like it’ll really help out in the long run when it comes to building more upgrades.
I think we should have 46 Gold coming our way from selling off our produce (plus 1 Gold from Lara); we also don’t need the Gardening Gloves anymore, so that’s 49. I also don’t think we need the Double Crossbow now that we have the Hunting Bow, so that’s 65. The remainder can be made up from selling the Crow Call, the Rat Fang Dagger, the Oxidicer, or the Pipes. Or several of those things, if we want to buy any additional supplies for the next dungeon (like Grave Flowers).
If we want to keep the Double Crossbow we could also sell the Crow Call, Rat Fang, Oxidicer, AND Pipes and still have enough for both upgrades (plus a little extra for supplies). Those four items don’t seem overwhelmingly useful to me, being mostly situational or a one-off in the case of the Crow Call, but that’s just my opinion. I also don’t think we need two ranged weapons for this next dungeon since we’ll presumably be taking Botanya, the Swiftblade, and the Corn Spear.
I personally think the Hunting Bow is much better than the Double Crossbow, since arrows and bolts both stack up to 6. The Hunting Bow is more situational since it’s best against animals, but I don’t think we’re going to be able to afford to use the double-shot of the crossbow all that often. Plus, the Hunting Bow has a weight of 1 while the Double Crossbow has a weight of 2, which means the Hunting Bow could get 12 shots off while the Crossbow might only get 3-6 if both get the same amount of inventory space dedicated to them.
TL;DR: Sell all produce and the Gardening Gloves, then pick some combination of Double Crossbow, Crow Call, Rat Fang Dagger, Oxidicer, and the Pipes to sell in order to get us up to 70 Gold. Use 70 Gold to buy Kobold Den+Sentry Post; use anything left over to buy supplies for zombie dungeon.
To be honest, I’d rather start seeing character development via buying the associated rooms for characters. We’ve had Kamau with us for a long time. I’d *love* to find out more about his story.
Plus, maybe if we further Kamau’s story, we can work at removing Remorse? Help him work through some of his trauma.
That’s my hope too. LSN has said previously that we’ll be very happy with the results of maxing bond. Given that bond dungeons have been mentioned, I’m assuming those are the blockers that prevent us from getting the last unit of bond. If that’s the case, buying the bedrooms is basically a down-payment on another dungeon that we’ll get once we max out the next bond series. Dungeons are where we get most of our gold, not labor, so I think we want to try to accelerate unlocking bond dungeons as much as possible.
Don’t get me wrong- I want to see more of the story as well! I just that I think making this investment as soon as possible will cause it to have the most impact in the long run. That being said, since I feel like the idea of getting Bond is going to be very popular, I have an addendum to my proposal.
If we want to afford both the Kobold Warrens, the Sentry Outpost, and either the Tower for Lara or the Ground Floor Apartment for Kamau, we can afford to purchase all three of those by selling the following items:
That gives us a total of 124.5 Gold to spend (Lara apparently finds a single Gold piece for us while we’re out), which just barely covers the cost of those three upgrades. Everything on this list is essentially expendable, either because it’s stuff we were going to sell anyways (the produce), or because we’ve picked up better/less situational stuff anyways (the weapons and armor), or because it’s a consumable (Crow Call, Potion). Or it’s the Pipes, which seem kinda crappy even if we do find someone with the Musical ability needed to use them effectively.
If we do this, though, I think we should consider checking out the Village Well instead of the zombie dungeon for our next dungeon crawl, since we’re going to have basically no money for Grave Flowers or any other supplies we might want to bring to deal with the undead. And if we go to the Well, we’ll want to bring along our heavy-hitters and be very careful/methodical while tackling the dungeon. But I think this would be a viable alternative plan if we REALLY want to build the Tower or Ground Floor Apartment and start building up Bond with Lara or Kamau again.
EDIT: We can also sell the following items if we want to:
-2x Shields (20 Gold, 10 Per)
-1x Heavy Shield (13 G)
-Staff of Gravity (20 G)
-Wolf Hide Armor (10 G)
If we add some of these to list above, it would be possible to boost us to over 170 Gold; enough to afford upgrades for Lara, Kamau, the Kobolds, and the Sentries with a little left over for gearing up for the next dungeon.
The Ko-Fi preview has “Death” with a face-down ninja, which heavily implies that there’s another party member at the zombie dungeon. Getting party members earlier gives us more chances to develop them, with the side benefit of a bit more Labour. I also hope that a partially-undead friend might not have such an issue with the lack of oxygen in the Well.
I was thinking of holding onto the pipes as a consistent combat action for Botanya, though I agree they aren’t very good. Didn’t notice how valuable those were. I’d lean towards dumping the Staff of Gravity for 20 gold, hard to figure out ways to use it and it’ll take up a slot for the entire dungeon for that one use.
I wasn’t sure about the Staff of Gravity because it seemed like other people wanted Lohk to eat it, but if people agree with getting rid of it I think we could definitely add it to the list.
For that matter- I mistook the Wolf Hide Armor that Molly was carrying for a second set of Plate. That might be worth selling as well for the additional 10 Gold. While we’re at it, we have four shields (2 regular, 1 heavy, 1 Magma), which is a bit excessive.
If we sold a Heavy Shield or a regular Shield that would give us an extra 10-13 Gold; and if we sell two Shields/1 Shield and the Heavy Shield, the Staff of Gravity, and the Wolf Hide Armor that’s an extra fifty gold. We could buy both upgrades for Kamau and Lara, give the Kobolds and Sentries a home, and have a little extra gold left over.
Fair point on giving Botanya a combat action; I guess it might be worth keeping the Pipes around for at least one Dungeon, just to see if it works out? Perhaps she’ll even be able to gain the Musical ability when she levels up, since they belonged to her mother apparently.
Staff of Gravity is our only staff, and I think the staff strike Monk robes build on Lohk is incredibly powerful. I’m against selling it until we have another staff to replace it.
I vote we never take this character, cause I prefer to play as intended. That’s my opinion though.
The intention is for us to die, as directly stated by LSN, so …
That’s not exactly what he said. He said that he’s not balancing the dungeons for us to win them, with win probably meaning “do everything totally safely, take no losses”. They’re supposed to be hard.
No. He directly stated he expected us to have lost someone by now.
Okay, but expecting someone to die is not the same as designing someone to die. Like him being surprised that twitch plays DnD hasn’t resulted in character deaths doesn’t mean he’s designing the encounters to kill us.
But he does design some encounters that he doesn’t have an inkling of how we will solve, like the King Rat in the vault. Usually those are optional. Or we can be surprised by a twist while out of resources.
Mind you, I am OK with it. I just leave the reminder because people shouldn’t assume we don’t need the new characters because the game is supposedly set up so we can always get out of trouble – it isn’t. It is supposed to be hardcore, there is supposed to be experimentation, and loss resulting from such experimentation. This was all said. We can eff up, or have an encounter we may not be able to beat just with the normal characters because of any reason, and the new characters should be used longterm to make us safer.
Just once, to see what they can do. Then we can let ’em stand by and watch. Please!
I for one welcome our new fungal overlord.
Word of God is that characters can die in the Dungeons. If it comes to pass that this new ‘fungal overlord’ falls and cannot get up.. how useful would mushroom soup be?
His HP is literally poison (he casts poison attacks from HP). So not useful at all.
Ye-es, but can the poison be destroyed by cooking process? Or can we use it as recreational substance?
Perhaps this would give a bonus similar to the ale? +3 atk with 50% chance to miss and 10% chance to hit a friendly if in range for 3 rounds?
Not nearly as busted as implied, though Little Mushroom will be a large part of that. I’m expecting some sort of Interpose-esque ability to redirect attacks, as being locked to 2 Def before rings and accessories is rough. Probably some healing too to offset using HP as a resource. Reminder that spending HP doesn’t create Remorse. Not even much inventory, though to be fair none of that will be spent on equipment for personal use.
Everyone other than Botanya is Bond capped, so not much loss to bringing the mushroom. Mushrooms aren’t plants, so I don’t expect Bloom to give additional HP.
Hmm, Infestation only needs organic creatures, but the undead we’ve lensed have been immune to poison damage so I don’t know if killing with poison damage would trigger. Might, if there was poison damage as part of the lethal attack including other damage. Wonder if Cordy tag teaming with Lara could trigger Infestation off Venomous Sting plus mushroom punch.
An overpowered character would be Kamau from before the fall. 15 HP, 3 Atk/Def, 3 ring slots, 12 inventory, built in Proficiency for a unique custom greatsword.
As ick as it is, I think we’re likely looking at Cordy being able to increase our Labor pool by 5-6 pets on the first dungeon he participates in, and then start taking tiers of Mushroom Master to start adding 6-7-8-9… labor each further dungeon he joins.
So he is, as thisnameismeta theorized, going to dramatically increase our gold-per-dungeon if we use him regularly.
I think we are still assuming an infinite loop that doesn’t exist, but now we got him, we should try him eventually.
Wrap up stream notes:
-For tackling the mob of chickens, Kamau’s Interpose works but if we brought three melee characters “They would split their attacks evenly, just animals” -LSN 2023
-Scarecrow prevents Magicrows from attacking. Theoretically this works on normal crows too, but just Magicrows in the dungeon. They cannot attack even if attacked, though once they’re hostile they will attack once you reach a room without a scarecrow.
-Crows moved on when no more produce in the room, mostly interested in the corn knight
-Scarecrow could be destroyed with damage or any amount of fire. Crows would then obliterate corn knight, but steal corn.
-Crows would wipe the dungeon for us if we let them
-Tromatochet introduced on its own to show off stats and instant alert
-Treehouse had the gardening gloves, showing how utility items like rope with no indicated purpose can be used. Also greater healing potion
-Setting tree on fire would deal with enemies, but then the chest is in a fire. The magma shield and fire robes together would probably make it safe if you could get up there.
-Elder magicrow hint: one eye 10 crows, second eye produce, third eye time limit. You have until turn 40 to give us 10 produce. Otherwise they attack the flower and would likely kill Botanya, no longer accepting bribes.
-Turn 15 the flower breaks ground and the scarecrow, growing one floor every 5 turns. Turn 35 reached the sky, then all the crows flock to the flower.
-Crows could fly above the barn through the gap in dungeon rooms
-Letting crows steal produce while helping them counts as bribing them, Magicrows are smarter than usual animals. If they got the 10 produce on their own they’d still leave but wouldn’t give the crow call.
-Other magic birds? Magepies? Created by QuadroCubes.
-Gravity staff on the sky works to keep crows away from there, but then they’re hostile for keeping them from food
-Pumpking would have been killed by hay drop. It is tough and has the Impassable ability, you can’t run by it. Lara web works to climb over. It drops a pumpkin.
-Chicken coop started with a rooster, every 5 turns it spits out a chicken and 20% chance of another rooster or 100% if there’s no rooster. If another rooster shows up, it takes half the chickens and starts wandering the dungeon.
-Farming for eggs lets you get the produce to win, but they only stack to 3 to discourage this.
-5 corn in the coop gives a pet egg, as we found.
-Potato beasts are afraid of light and that drops Def to 0. They’re a grue.
-A dungeon with spawners can be cleared if there are no current monsters in the dungeon. Any theoretical chickens in the indestructible, inaccessible coop don’t count.
-Rats chest had unique Frying Pan, 2 fire damage weapon which can cook food. Raw meat, or convert produce to healing items. Corn to popcorn, 50% chance to heal 1 because it’s so plentiful. Fried egg, tomato sauce… Didn’t fully stat out all options because we didn’t get the pan.
-Keys in barn would open locked doors.
-Stalkroach went downstairs away from light, past enemies, then eaten by a grue/potato. With other chests opened first it couldn’t hide well.
-2 unblockable fall damage from roof to ledge, or just die to ground. One floor down is safe, 2+ floors deal damage. Gravity reduction from staff halves falling damage and half of 1 is 0.
-Weather vane: Change which direction the crows and chickens move. Pumpking would let monsters out. They have to move with the wind unless they’re at the end. With wind to the left crows would bounce between the first two rooms with scarecrows and we could kill them without them able to fight back.
-Bats: 3 regular, 1 mystery type.
-Chickens can climb ladders, couldn’t just pick off the big barn crowd from range.
-Mammoth tusks are treasure, weight 1 cost 10. Mammoth hide is hide armour +5Def vs cold. Hay bale would deal 5 unblockable damage if dropped.
-Manny can’t fit into the barn, and 3 turns of trying would knock down the barn which would destroy all but the vane, the coop, and the now open puzzle chest. Probably 5 unblockable damage per floor above you, so in short anyone inside would die, with the “explicit” hint that anyone in the barn would feel the whole barn shaking from being hit by a mammoth.
-Puzzle chest contains Breaker, 1 handed hammer +3. Can smash unopened non-puzzle chests which also destroys any item inside, gets +1 Atk per chest destroyed up to 3, reset at end of dungeon. Sacrifice loot for a +6 one-handed weapon?
-Reward for not killing Manny is to feel good about yourself.
-Macadamia could totally Dig into the underground room before turn 15, but not much reason to try.
-Locked chest underground had Mystic Vase. 5x dungeon heal 2 HP to a plant, tool/treasure cost 20. Also Monk Robes (from belt because no belt slot, too hard to see) and pipes which now have special effect with a music ability.
-Chests have items from mother’s friends. This is from another game which should release later this year.
-Jumping off the flower would be 5 unblockable damage from falling
-Botanya cannot attack with wands, though she could use a wand of fireball to burn a rope. Her flytrap pet is mobile even though the enemy is immobile.
-All pets are small or smallish so they can always follow.
-There are no negative numbers in Dungeon Eyes. Penalties can’t give you a stat below 0, though all bonuses are given a chance to cancel out.
-Enemy drops cannot be taken with Steal or found with Case, even the gold pieces thugs have. The drop chance isn’t even rolled until the enemy group is finished off.
-Bows are different for crossbow proficiency. A slingshot might count as a crossbow.
-Case works on puzzle chests. Case gives item stats, including for chest contents.
-Sneaky is an action. If you want to do anything else, it’ll need to be on the next turn after sneaking through. If this puts you behind enemies, they probably won’t turn to see you.
-Trap Disarming: can disarm onions. Might or might not identify the trap you disarmed, especially if the trigger is separate from the trap like in the Warrens where the pressure plate activated the arrow chest.
-Rat kings spawn on turn 40 and every 10 turns, first at back and second at front. Even worse things might come up at 60 (every room grows a corn knight?), but that wasn’t necessary.
-Gardening gloves shield from onions and let you pick all plants of one type at once. Won’t come up again
-Being on the flower while it’s growing isn’t dangerous.
-Dungeon creatures can be followers vs pets. Botanya counted as a follower, not really helping. Manny wouldn’t really follow.
-How does Pumpking fight? Dirty.
-A full stack of produce might distract a rat king for a turn.
-Building housing for all the other NPCs isn’t something we do for a reward, that is the goal. Labour isn’t how to get gold, dungeons are for gold.
-Renovations don’t give benefits until the dungeon after you buy them since they need to be built. If we buy a room this time, it’ll be after dungeon 8 that the room finishes and we get the HP boost and Bond cap break.
-Recruiting a pet during the dungeon when at max pet capacity would send the pet to the Manor.
-Only pet master pet eggs are random. Not a coincidence that the chicken pet egg hatched into a chick.
-If this goes past 3 years, grouchy… 5 years tops. Don’t need another 10-year comic. My observation: Combine that with how we’ve done 7 dungeons in just over a year, and consider how long term you really want to plan for character growth.
-Inspecting a dungeon element is an action (!) you are expected to take sometimes.
-Drew turn 50 page on Sunday with departure vote, then vote shifted by Monday so that was scrapped.
-The last turn with multi panel montage does include actions, and then narrative exit.
-Kamau, Lara, and Macadamia formally joined the party in the dungeon as the party couldn’t be full yet. Macadamia followed for a while first. Other characters might follow, might join in intermission, might join mid dungeon if someone dies.
Thank you!
Highlights:
Renovations have build time. We need to get those rooms online soon if we want to get more bond points. I now suspect that there won’t be a friendship dungeon for clearing the first block, I think that the friendship dungeon is unlocked at the second block and completing that dungeon with the character is what maxes bond since every bond track has only one point in the third section. If this is right, we could max Lara pretty quickly and get that max bond bonus for Ricki.
More expectation about total game length: The projection is 3 years of dungeon eyes to finish, and we’ve passed one year. Don’t take renovations in hopes of paying themselves back in 10 dungeons because the game will be almost over by then. For level up choices, if your argument is “this will eventually get better”, you should also explain how many of the expected 14 remaining dungeons will benefit, and which ones will see that character. We might get a few more, there are 7 friendship dungeons if each of the 7 non bonus characters get one, but the game will end. Eventually you have to stop saving for the future and cash in.
Yeah, so wildly projecting off of those comments, as LSN did kinda revise upward after initially saying 3 years total, we’re looking at 21-35 total dungeons (3-5×7… unless they start getting shorter/we get better about exiting quickly, or… just about anything at all changes, really), and 14-28 remaining of that number.
He also made a bunch of comments around character progression indicating that we can’t plan on getting everything (obviously) and that we’ll need to pick and choose.
Which I think is going to strongly encourage us to really focus on growing a core party and leaving everybody else as level 1-2 scrubs. CLASSIC RPG (Looking right at you, Torneko Taloon).
Or just benching those with max bond.
>Don’t take renovations in hopes of paying themselves back in 10 dungeons because the game will be almost over by then.
I think it’s less that they necessarily need to pay themselves off within a certain timeframe, and more that if we’re going to build them AT ALL we need to build them as quickly as possible.
There’s not much point in building the Kobold Den or the Sentry Outpost at dungeon 20 because the game will be over or close to over by then. But if we build them now, we’ll both a) make our money back, and b) supplement our hauls from future dungeons so we can afford other upgrades.
I outlined a plan in a different comment that would let us get the Kobold Den and the Sentry Outpost by selling stuff we don’t need/aren’t using, which would mean +7 Gold for each Dungeon we complete once built for the price of 70 Gold. For roughly that same price, we could either increase someone’s bond threshold and maybe pick up one of the renovations that gives additional storage/upgrade paths (80 Gold), or we could pick up two of those renovations that give additional storage/upgrade paths (60 Gold). Between those three options I feel like buying Labor is honestly the best use of our money.
There’s also the possibility that Labor will be useful for other things aside from just a flat 1 Labor = 1 Gold at some point, or that Labor will become more efficient with certain upgrades. Even something like 3 Labor:4 Gold would be good, let alone a 2:3 or 1:2 ratio for Labor:Gold.
We’re locked on bond for everybody but Botanya at this point. We’ve been told maxing bond out will be very very good, so we need to prioritize it. I expect that it’ll be much more impactful than additional labor.
I’m sure that maxing bond out will be good, sure. The thing is- even if we build Kamau or Lara’s upgrade now, we still have to both a) increase their bond to the NEXT threshold, and b) do whatever we need to do to get past the second threshold after that in order to fully max out their Bond. Until we do that, the only thing we’re getting from those upgrades is the ability to get Bond for those characters and an additional +1 HP for characters that haven’t really needed it thus far.
Basically, I think that going for Lara or Kamau’s upgrade right now is a risky use of our current funds because it doesn’t give us much for the amount of gold we’re spending, whereas spending our gold on Labor now is a pretty safe bet because it can only offer us more gold over time. Buying Labor now also means that we’ll be able to more easily afford character upgrades in the future.
EDIT: That being said, if we DO decide to build a character upgrade I think we should do Lara’s first. Doing that will give us a better idea of what that means more quickly since she only needs one Bond point to reach her next threshold. But if we have to build a second upgrade to get past that second threshold- which is what I’m worried about- we’re really going to want to build up as much Labor as we possibly can to have as much income as we possibly can. Hence, why I’m advocating for the Kobolds and Sentries.
Plus- think of the children, man! Those poor Kobolds got kicked out of their home; the least we could do is build them a place to sleep so they can have somewhere comfortable to sleep while building the rest of the manor and harvesting our crops!
The thing we need to do to get to the next threshold is probably the bond dungeon. Since dungeons are our major source of income, getting set up to do bond dungeons sooner rather than later also boosts income, and gives us effectively more time and total income.
You’re probably right about the next threshold being the bond dungeon.
That being said: I still think building up the passive gold that we’re getting at the manor as quickly as possible is more important. If we have 7 Labor and three characters/pets stay behind, that gives us 10 Gold per dungeon.
That’s 10 Gold towards any other upgrade, per dungeon, before we even account for the loot we find.
That 10 Gold gets us 1/3 of the way towards advancing one of the different upgrade paths (like the kitchen); or it means we only need to bring in 40 Gold worth of stuff to get a character specific upgrade. Not to mention the possibility of using it to buy basic supplies, ammunition, etc.
The ability to get bond points is important, yes, and I definitely think we should think about building Lara and Kamau’s upgrades within the next few dungeons. But building up this infrastructure now is going to give us a ton of benefit over time. It’s basically RTS logic; you gotta have your farmers, miners, lumberjacks, etc. producing resources (Gold) before you worry about building up your big advanced units (adventurers).
Counterpoint. If a dungeon gives us 40 or so gold loot on average, we will unlock Lara’s bond dungeon in two dungeons if we build her room now and take her to the dungeon after it is done. That would yield 40 gold after 3 dungeons, compared to at best 8 gold in the same time period for the 4 labor from the kobold warrens.
I don’t think we can really rely on getting consistent gold per dungeon, though? This last adventure was a bit of an outlier because we were basically farming (ba-dum-tish) gold. Expecting to get fifty gold per dungeon, or even fourty, would basically assume that we don’t like any of the loot we got. That or we got good enough loot that we can feel good about selling older big ticket items without feeling bad.
Again- buying Labor is the safest bet because we know that we’re paying for something that will appreciate in value over time, which means that buying it quickly is smarter than waiting. Every point of Labor is a guaranteed 1 Gold, and Gold is the only resource that matters when it comes to upgrading the manor, which subsequently unlocks character upgrades and other upgrade paths that we don’t even know about yet.
It would take 11 dungeons between when we spend the gold to get the kobold housing and when the labor from the kobold warrens have paid for themselves (because it takes a dungeon for the building to complete, and only adds 4 labor). I’m absolutely in favor of building the NPC housing, but not at the expense of wasting multiple dungeons worth of bond when all of our characters are maxed. I want to see as much story as possible, and given the timeline we are on, I don’t think we can afford to put off building character bedrooms as long as you seem to want us to. If you don’t think we will net enough gold to build character bedrooms in average dungeons, then it’s even more important that we not spend our windfall on upgrades that will take 10 dungeons to even return the money spent on them, let alone start funding further upgrades.
The thing is- if we don’t buy them at a certain point, they’re actually going to be a net negative on our finances because we won’t “pay them off” in time. If we hold off on them now, then that’s seven less Gold in our pocket for each Dungeon we wait for building them. In two dungeons, that’ll be 14 Gold; in three, it’ll be 21, and so on.
I’ve also detailed a revised plan down below that would let us afford the 120 Gold required to buy the Kobolds, the Sentries, AND either the Tower for Lara or the Apartment for Kamau by selling a lot of our clutter. I think picking the Tower would be a pretty good idea, since it would potentially let us do Lara’s Bond Dungeon after we finish up with the Village Well/Zombie Tomb.
The thing about that is that they’re never a net negative on our finances if we don’t build them. We probably won’t and can’t build every room in the Manor. Sure, then we never get the income, but every dungeon that gets us closer to maxing Bond means more dungeons to take advantage of whatever abilities Ricki gets from maxing out Bond. To put it this way, say that we were told we’d get an extra level up two dungeons from now – would it be worth spending 4 gold now to get that extra level up at the end of next dungeon so we get an extra dungeon’s worth of that ability?
I also suspect that the bond dungeons may not even be available until after the next big story event, just like how it wasn’t possible to break the first cap until we unlocked the Manor and the ability to build rooms. Lara’s Tower is the only way to know for sure. Either way, we need to pick someone that we’ll want to use in the dungeon after the next one.
That’s true; at the same time, I feel like building up Labor early is going to pay off at some point. It’s very odd that it would take 11 Dungeons to pay off the cost of buying Labor, as other people have pointed out. It really makes me think that at some point we’ll be able to upgrade our Labor; either by making it generate more income, or by allowing us to use our Labor to generate other resources at a discount (for example, Healing Potions and other consumables).
In any case, I don’t want to belabor my point too much. We have a ton of potential cash on hand at the moment, but we do still have to be a bit careful about how spend it if we want to buy other items aside from Manor upgrades.
Honestly, it might be best to buy a little bit of everything; grab Labor, a room for Kamau and/or Lara, and check out one of the potential upgrade paths like the Kitchen or Library. That would give us a little margin for gearing up for the zombies, I think.
LSN said directly on stream that housing NPCs is a goal, not a means to an end. Labour is a nice bonus to have as a reward for people not dying, and I don’t think that Labour being suspiciously bad for cost is an indication that it will get better.
Agreed that Library is promising, as that seems most likely to unlock access to more enchantment scrolls. Getting more out of existing equipment is the next way to become stronger now that we mostly filled out our slots with good stuff.
“You have until turn 40 to give us 10 produce.”
We finished the feeding on turn https://dungeoneyes.com/dungeon-7-turn-38/ – barely in time again.
Just in Time
ManufacturingDungeoneering – BuildingIncredibly FragileEfficientSupply ChainsDungeon Turns for You and MeThanks for the summary KM!
Feeling good is an AWESOME reward.
I must agree wholeheartedly.
But that’s roleplaying, NOT minmaxing. So I doubt the audience for this game will go for it.
We literally went for it?
Oh come on, you can’t even be convincing enough to pretend you care for the comic/game anymore. Stop it, please.
Oh, I like the game a lot. It’s just dealing with these minmaxing munchkins that grab the steering wheel and won’t let go. Everything is all about increasing stats or stat-related. “How can we get the biggest possible haul from this dungeon” because obviously that’s why this game was created in the first place.
Are you under the impression that you’re fighting on my behalf? You aren’t.
We also got confirmation that heavy strike does work with cleave to buff the subsequent attack that cleave triggered. The -3 from cleave is off of the previous attack, not what a new attack would theoretically be absent heavy strike etc.
Sorry about the magepies everyone! But also not sorry at all.
Yay!
Go Cordy! Go Cordy! The SHROOM with the BOOM!
I say we take Cordy into the dungeon. Let’s check out what those lil’ mushroom pets can do!
So, what sorts of upgrades are we thinking about in regards to the manor? As much as I’d like to start working on bond stuff, it seems like buying additional Labor might give us the best return on our gold in the long term.
We have seven characters now, which means we should have a base level of 3 Labor for this next dungeon even if we don’t buy anything. (I believe the 1 Labor we have now is from Lara.) Each point of Labor = +1 Gold per dungeon that we don’t have to worry about carrying home. If we don’t take all of our pets (taking the pet chick seems like a really bad idea for example) then we also get additional Labor for each one we don’t take.
If we buy the Kobold Den and Sentry Post that gives us a baseline of 7 Labor, not accounting for any characters or pets that might die who will also contribute to that amount if they’re left at home. +7 Gold per dungeon isn’t overwhelmingly amazing, but it’ll definitely add-up the quicker we’re able to get those things built. And when you account for the fact that Labor is supposed to be a secondary source of Gold income compared to dungeon loot I feel like it’ll really help out in the long run when it comes to building more upgrades.
I think we should have 46 Gold coming our way from selling off our produce (plus 1 Gold from Lara); we also don’t need the Gardening Gloves anymore, so that’s 49. I also don’t think we need the Double Crossbow now that we have the Hunting Bow, so that’s 65. The remainder can be made up from selling the Crow Call, the Rat Fang Dagger, the Oxidicer, or the Pipes. Or several of those things, if we want to buy any additional supplies for the next dungeon (like Grave Flowers).
If we want to keep the Double Crossbow we could also sell the Crow Call, Rat Fang, Oxidicer, AND Pipes and still have enough for both upgrades (plus a little extra for supplies). Those four items don’t seem overwhelmingly useful to me, being mostly situational or a one-off in the case of the Crow Call, but that’s just my opinion. I also don’t think we need two ranged weapons for this next dungeon since we’ll presumably be taking Botanya, the Swiftblade, and the Corn Spear.
I personally think the Hunting Bow is much better than the Double Crossbow, since arrows and bolts both stack up to 6. The Hunting Bow is more situational since it’s best against animals, but I don’t think we’re going to be able to afford to use the double-shot of the crossbow all that often. Plus, the Hunting Bow has a weight of 1 while the Double Crossbow has a weight of 2, which means the Hunting Bow could get 12 shots off while the Crossbow might only get 3-6 if both get the same amount of inventory space dedicated to them.
TL;DR: Sell all produce and the Gardening Gloves, then pick some combination of Double Crossbow, Crow Call, Rat Fang Dagger, Oxidicer, and the Pipes to sell in order to get us up to 70 Gold. Use 70 Gold to buy Kobold Den+Sentry Post; use anything left over to buy supplies for zombie dungeon.
To be honest, I’d rather start seeing character development via buying the associated rooms for characters. We’ve had Kamau with us for a long time. I’d *love* to find out more about his story.
Plus, maybe if we further Kamau’s story, we can work at removing Remorse? Help him work through some of his trauma.
That’s my hope too. LSN has said previously that we’ll be very happy with the results of maxing bond. Given that bond dungeons have been mentioned, I’m assuming those are the blockers that prevent us from getting the last unit of bond. If that’s the case, buying the bedrooms is basically a down-payment on another dungeon that we’ll get once we max out the next bond series. Dungeons are where we get most of our gold, not labor, so I think we want to try to accelerate unlocking bond dungeons as much as possible.
Don’t get me wrong- I want to see more of the story as well! I just that I think making this investment as soon as possible will cause it to have the most impact in the long run. That being said, since I feel like the idea of getting Bond is going to be very popular, I have an addendum to my proposal.
If we want to afford both the Kobold Warrens, the Sentry Outpost, and either the Tower for Lara or the Ground Floor Apartment for Kamau, we can afford to purchase all three of those by selling the following items:
-10x Carrots (13 Gold)
-5x Tomatoes (8 G)
-5x Onions (8 G)
-3x Potatoes (6 G)
-3x Eggs (6 G)
-2x Corn (5 G)
-Gardening Gloves (2.5 G)
-Pipes (7.5 G)
-Double Crossbow (16 G)
-Rat Fang Dagger (5 G)
-Leather Armor (6.5 G)
-Oxidicer (6 G)
-Owlbear Cowlwear (7.5 G)
-Crow Call (18 G)
-Potion of Greater Healing (8.5 G)
That gives us a total of 124.5 Gold to spend (Lara apparently finds a single Gold piece for us while we’re out), which just barely covers the cost of those three upgrades. Everything on this list is essentially expendable, either because it’s stuff we were going to sell anyways (the produce), or because we’ve picked up better/less situational stuff anyways (the weapons and armor), or because it’s a consumable (Crow Call, Potion). Or it’s the Pipes, which seem kinda crappy even if we do find someone with the Musical ability needed to use them effectively.
If we do this, though, I think we should consider checking out the Village Well instead of the zombie dungeon for our next dungeon crawl, since we’re going to have basically no money for Grave Flowers or any other supplies we might want to bring to deal with the undead. And if we go to the Well, we’ll want to bring along our heavy-hitters and be very careful/methodical while tackling the dungeon. But I think this would be a viable alternative plan if we REALLY want to build the Tower or Ground Floor Apartment and start building up Bond with Lara or Kamau again.
EDIT: We can also sell the following items if we want to:
-2x Shields (20 Gold, 10 Per)
-1x Heavy Shield (13 G)
-Staff of Gravity (20 G)
-Wolf Hide Armor (10 G)
If we add some of these to list above, it would be possible to boost us to over 170 Gold; enough to afford upgrades for Lara, Kamau, the Kobolds, and the Sentries with a little left over for gearing up for the next dungeon.
The Ko-Fi preview has “Death” with a face-down ninja, which heavily implies that there’s another party member at the zombie dungeon. Getting party members earlier gives us more chances to develop them, with the side benefit of a bit more Labour. I also hope that a partially-undead friend might not have such an issue with the lack of oxygen in the Well.
I was thinking of holding onto the pipes as a consistent combat action for Botanya, though I agree they aren’t very good. Didn’t notice how valuable those were. I’d lean towards dumping the Staff of Gravity for 20 gold, hard to figure out ways to use it and it’ll take up a slot for the entire dungeon for that one use.
I wasn’t sure about the Staff of Gravity because it seemed like other people wanted Lohk to eat it, but if people agree with getting rid of it I think we could definitely add it to the list.
For that matter- I mistook the Wolf Hide Armor that Molly was carrying for a second set of Plate. That might be worth selling as well for the additional 10 Gold. While we’re at it, we have four shields (2 regular, 1 heavy, 1 Magma), which is a bit excessive.
If we sold a Heavy Shield or a regular Shield that would give us an extra 10-13 Gold; and if we sell two Shields/1 Shield and the Heavy Shield, the Staff of Gravity, and the Wolf Hide Armor that’s an extra fifty gold. We could buy both upgrades for Kamau and Lara, give the Kobolds and Sentries a home, and have a little extra gold left over.
Fair point on giving Botanya a combat action; I guess it might be worth keeping the Pipes around for at least one Dungeon, just to see if it works out? Perhaps she’ll even be able to gain the Musical ability when she levels up, since they belonged to her mother apparently.
Staff of Gravity is our only staff, and I think the staff strike Monk robes build on Lohk is incredibly powerful. I’m against selling it until we have another staff to replace it.